Rochelle Has Another UTI

[Time Bandit]

laurief - Thanks for your reply...I always appreciate your insight. I do not believe they ran a culture... They just came back with a urinalysis, and said while her white and red blood cells were pretty normal, there was bacteria in her urine...I would assume having a culture ran, would tell me what kind of bacteria, right? I didn't even think of that, and the vet didn't mention it. They prescribed her Marbofloxacin...I also assume that's one of the generic antibiotics you mentioned?

konstargirl - Thanks for the well wishes. Rochelle seems to be feeling a bit better, but I can still see she's in a bit of pain. Hopefully, she'll be all better when we go back to the vet for her re-check. Alice has been pretty miserable every time we have to put Rochelle in the bathroom. She misses her buddy, and shows it by just laying all lethargic like outside the bathroom door. I feel bad for her.

[laurief]

Originally Posted by Time Bandit

They just came back with a urinalysis, and said while her white and red blood cells were pretty normal, there was bacteria in her urine

Hmm. If her WBC count was normal and she had bacteria in her urine, I wouldn't necessarily assume that she has a UTI. The problem is that anytime urine is expressed naturally through the urethra and hits the "world" outside of the cat, it can become immediately exposed to bacteria in the environment. So unless the urine sample is taken directly from the bladder with a needle (cystocentesis), contamination can confuse the results. That doesn't necessarily mean that Rochelle doesn't have a UTI, but it also doesn't necessarily mean that she does. I have been told by different vets that interstitial cystitis (urinary tract inflammation of unknown cause) is far more common in cats than UTI, but they can have identical symptoms (other than elevated WBC). If Rochelle does have interstitial cystitis, which is most commonly caused or exacerbated by stress, being isolated in the bathroom is probably making her worse instead than better.

I would assume having a culture ran, would tell me what kind of bacteria, right?

If the urine is acquired through cystocentesis, a culture could tell you both whether or not she really does have an infection AND which bacteria is causing the infection. But there are a couple of problems here, too. First, a culture takes several days to return results. Second, it's possible that the antibiotic has already killed off enough bacteria to produce a negative culture (I'm not sure about that, though).

They prescribed her Marbofloxacin...I also assume that's one of the generic antibiotics you mentioned?

I'm not acquainted with Marbofloxacin. I'm guessing that it's a newer antibiotic that your vet prescribed because the earlier antibiotics didn't seem to completely clear the presumed infection. But I'm just guessing here. You should ask your vet about that.

Alice has been pretty miserable every time we have to put Rochelle in the bathroom. She misses her buddy, and shows it by just laying all lethargic like outside the bathroom door. I feel bad for her.

If I were you, I'd either let Rochelle out of the bathroom or put Alice in there with her. No reason for them both to be miserable, esp. if Rochelle's problem may involve a stress factor.

Laurie

[Time Bandit]

Thanks for taking the time to respond Laurie.

Originally Posted by laurief

Hmm. If her WBC count was normal and she had bacteria in her urine, I wouldn't necessarily assume that she has a UTI. The problem is that anytime urine is expressed naturally through the urethra and hits the "world" outside of the cat, it can become immediately exposed to bacteria in the environment. So unless the urine sample is taken directly from the bladder with a needle (cystocentesis), contamination can confuse the results. That doesn't necessarily mean that Rochelle doesn't have a UTI, but it also doesn't necessarily mean that she does. I have been told by different vets that interstitial cystitis (urinary tract inflammation of unknown cause) is far more common in cats than UTI, but they can have identical symptoms (other than elevated WBC). If Rochelle does have interstitial cystitis, which is most commonly caused or exacerbated by stress, being isolated in the bathroom is probably making her worse instead than better.

Very interesting. Thanks for the info. Interstitial cystitis is something I hadn't heard of before...if that is a possibility, I wonder what kind of stress she's having, and what I could do about it...

Originally Posted by laurief

If the urine is acquired through cystocentesis, a culture could tell you both whether or not she really does have an infection AND which bacteria is causing the infection. But there are a couple of problems here, too. First, a culture takes several days to return results. Second, it's possible that the antibiotic has already killed off enough bacteria to produce a negative culture (I'm not sure about that, though).

Yeah, I called up today (since they were closed over the holiday weekend), and they said it would most likely be too late for the culture now, since the antibiotics should be doing their job by now. =/ If it is something like the Interstitial cystitis you mentioned before, is that something that would still show up in a culture, if she's not getting treated for it? I'm just curious if I should get a culture done at her re-check, or wait to see if she ever gets this again and then do a culture...

Originally Posted by laurief

I'm not acquainted with Marbofloxacin. I'm guessing that it's a newer antibiotic that your vet prescribed because the earlier antibiotics didn't seem to completely clear the presumed infection. But I'm just guessing here. You should ask your vet about that.

I checked out Marbofloxacin on the Felipedia. It says: "Marbofloxacin (Zeniquin) is a third-generation synthetic fluoroquinolone for use in feline medicine. It has good bioavailability within the blood of cats and shows low accumulative effects after repeated doses[1].
This broad-spectrum antibiotic has been used successfully in treating diseases such as feline lower urinary tract disease (FLUTD)[2], cat flu[3], chronic FIV[4], Chlamydophila felis[5], Bartonella henselae[6] and Mycoplasma hemofelis[7].
The recommended dose is 2.75-5.5 mg/kg orally every 24 hours."


I also re-checked what they gave Rochelle for her last UTI and it was Marbofloxacin too. I'm now curious as to why they are giving me generic multi-sickness antibiotics...aren't there meds specifically for UTI's? I'd assume thats what they should have given me last time, since she had a definite UTI. I'm gonna ask about this next time we go in.

Originally Posted by laurief

If I were you, I'd either let Rochelle out of the bathroom or put Alice in there with her. No reason for them both to be miserable, esp. if Rochelle's problem may involve a stress factor.

Yeah, when I read that you said it could be stress related, I made a few changes. Rochelle still can't be trusted not to inappropriately urinate on things, so she still needs to spend the nights in the bathroom. But I've been putting Alice in there with her now, and that seems to be really helping the both of them. They are trashing my bathroom, but it's worth it if they're happy. Rochelle has very limited time in the bathroom days now, since I have a lighter work schedule the next two weeks, but Alice is still hanging out with her. Samantha is fine on her own...she's much more attached to me than she is the other girls.

[laurief]

Originally Posted by Time Bandit

Interstitial cystitis is something I hadn't heard of before...if that is a possibility, I wonder what kind of stress she's having, and what I could do about it...

It's also called idiopathic cystitis. You can Google them both and find TONS to read. Stress isn't the only thing that can bring it on, but it's probably the most common factor. Two of my cats have had bouts of interstitial cystitis related to stress. One of them was particularly worrisome because he had suffered a complete urinary blockage a couple of years earlier. So when he started peeing blood spots all over the house and showing obvious signs of pain, I was afraid he had blocked again. As it turned out, he had no crystals that time, but the stress of having his brother pick on him had brought on cystitis.

If it is something like the Interstitial cystitis you mentioned before, is that something that would still show up in a culture, if she's not getting treated for it?

No. The very definition of interstitial/idiopathic cystitis is that the cause can not be determined through testing.

I'm just curious if I should get a culture done at her re-check, or wait to see if she ever gets this again and then do a culture...

Wait till she shows symptoms again (hoping she won't ever show symptoms again), and have a culture done BEFORE you start her on antibiotics again.

I checked out Marbofloxacin on the Felipedia ... This broad-spectrum antibiotic has been used successfully in treating diseases such as feline lower urinary tract disease (FLUTD)[2]

That's why your vet keeps prescribing it whenever Rochelle exhibits symptoms of UTI (FLUTD). It's a broad-spectrum antibiotic with known action against at least some UTI-causing bacteria. This is a very common strategy used by most vets who want to start treating a UTI right away without waiting for culture results and/or who are trying to minimize testing expenses for their clients.

aren't there meds specifically for UTI's?

No. Specific antibiotics kill specific bacteria. UTI's can be caused by a number of different bacteria, which is why vets attack them with broad-spectrum antibiotics that can kill a bunch of different bacteria. Unfortunately, sometimes the specific bacteria that is causing a specific cat's current UTI doesn't happen to be one of the bacteria that the particular vet-prescribed antibiotic can kill. That's where a culture comes in handy. It can identify the specific bacteria at work so that the vet can choose an antibiotic with known efficacy against that specific bacteria.

Yeah, when I read that you said it could be stress related, I made a few changes.

That's good. Sounds like both Rochelle and Alice are a lot happier and more relaxed now. Stress never helps healing, regardless of the cause of the malady.

Laurie

[Time Bandit]

Thanks again for your insight Laurie! I will definitely be doing some research tonight on idiopathic cystitis/interstitial cystitis. One of the things I wish I knew more about is cat medicine and illnesses. I just feel so helpless when one of my babies gets sick!

I'm hoping Rochelle never has to go through this again, but if so, I will be remembering to get a culture done on her first. At least then we'll know what we're dealing with here.

And a small update on how Rochelle is doing. She did the cutest thing today. She usually follows me into the bathroom, so she did, and she started sniffing around the litter boxes. She went in, urinated, covered...and then hopped out with her tail waving high, looked right at me and gave me this happy "meow", like she was saying, "Look Mommy, I used the box again!" I couldn't stop praising her. I'm glad she seems to be in better spirits!

[Sinatra-Butters]

*Huggles for Rochelle*