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Old 01-24-2013, 02:04 PM   #21 (permalink)
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My area has often been described as "socially deprived" - it is not a rich area by any stretch of the imagination and yet even the local council has managed to go no kill (without really good reason).
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Old 01-24-2013, 02:11 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Blakeney Green View Post
To give an example of the different attitudes toward pets that I'm talking about - when I had to take time off work to bring Maisie to the vet for his rabies vaccination, multiple people (who I know have animals of their own) asked me how he got rabies since I weirdly keep my cats indoors. Things like spending money on preventative vet care rather than simply replacing pets when they die, even, can be a new concept for some people, let alone worrying about what happens to pets no one owns.

As I've said several times, I do believe that shelters never killing pets for reasons of space is a goal that can be achieved. I have no disagreement with the basic concepts of the no-kill movement.

Where I hit a roadblock, though, is when I hear that all it takes is a few easy changes... because sometimes the obstacles are fundamental to the culture and not entirely in the shelter's hands. It's doable, but it can be very tough when the issue is less about shelter space and more that not everyone understands why we should care about the issue in the first place.
I meet people ride the "dumb bus". Its very frustrating! Ive also seen so many animal lovers who love to give and be involved when they see a group doing great things for dogs and cats.

Your road block concern is litigate. From the reading Ive done and videos from the No Kill Conference is, its achieved by hard work and dedicated people. But when your doing what you love it doesn't feel like hard work. Atleast in my case this is true.
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Old 01-24-2013, 02:38 PM   #23 (permalink)
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From the reading Ive done and videos from the No Kill Conference is, its achieved by hard work and dedicated people.
Yeah, this is where I think we're in basic agreement. There are times when advocates of the no-kill movement come off as... I can only describe it as flippant. Like it's no big deal and if there's an issue, it's only because people don't want it enough. I feel that's both unrealistic, and unfair to people who are already working hard in challenging situations. (Not meaning you were flippant, M&T, just speaking more generally.) I actually find it a lot easier to listen and not feel alienated when it's acknowledged that it can be an uphill battle.

The shelter local shelter in the area I've moved to is no-kill, in a very economically challenged area. I was there yesterday for the first time dropping off a donation. They try so hard. But man... it was sad. I wish they had more resources. They're obviously dedicated and could do great things.
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Old 01-24-2013, 02:51 PM   #24 (permalink)
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ETA, since I'm past the edit window: I didn't mean to imply they aren't doing great things already. It's amazing how much they've accomplished on the donations they've managed to raise. It would just be awesome if they had more.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:21 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Blakeney Green View Post
Yeah, this is where I think we're in basic agreement. There are times when advocates of the no-kill movement come off as... I can only describe it as flippant. Like it's no big deal and if there's an issue, it's only because people don't want it enough. I feel that's both unrealistic, and unfair to people who are already working hard in challenging situations. (Not meaning you were flippant, M&T, just speaking more generally.) I actually find it a lot easier to listen and not feel alienated when it's acknowledged that it can be an uphill battle.
I admit I do that sometimes, but I think that is because of where I grew up: our shelter was no kill-despite huge numbers of stray and feral cats. We had a foster program that fed to the shelter (people volunteered to foster cats up to 2 weeks before placing them in the shelter). Our local vet did all the spay/neuter for free (he'd do this for low income people too), but he is a rarity. Partially because he was the only vet in town, he really had the money to not be concerned, and he truly cared for animals. He also ran his own pseudo shelter at his office and on his farm. Because of this, I sometimes have a hard time remembering how hard everyone had to work to keep the no kill, but I try! It is hard, and for us, it was a community effort. Everyone in town was behind it and believed in it, and I think it really paid off
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:18 PM   #26 (permalink)
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I went to 4 shelters when I was looking to adopt my cats. The first 2 were very small and private (about 10-15 cats), the 3rd quite a bit larger (about 35 cats) but still private. The cats weren't confined to cages at any of them. At that larger one, they were in a very large room with multiple litter boxes and feeding stations and most were lounging around. On the one hand, it was great not to see them in cages. On the other, it was a turn-off to me as a potential adopter. It smelled like cat urine and just felt dirty. I'm sure they kept everything clean, but with that many cats, you'd have to scoop or change the litter and vacuum pretty much constantly. Also, it was hard to see all of the cats. The timid ones would hide, and some would move as you moved around, so you couldn't necessarily keep track of which cats you'd already seen. It was like cat overload, and I ended up spending not more than 5 or 10 minutes there. That sort of set-up seems to me more suitable to a sanctuary than a shelter that wants to adopt out animals.

I did adopt my first cat from one of the small shelters, in a very rural area. Honestly, I don't even know if they had the cats in cages or not, though the large dogs were in a large pen outside. When I said I liked tabbies, they took me to a separate little building with about 4 kittens inside, roaming free. I don't remember why they were separated like that.

I believe that at all 3, they took care of s/n before the animals were adopted out.

The current 2 were from the local SPCA, where the cats were in a huge room, all caged. There were easily 70-80, and one had been there for 2 years. But they also had a cat room, where the kitties who got along with the other kitties were allowed to play for a certain amount of time each day. The adoption fee included the price of s/n and microchipping. Once you paid, they scheduled you for the s/n.

My last vet had a low-cost s/n program - I think it was once a month. I don't know about the current vet, but I'm going to ask.
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