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Old 02-22-2013, 09:46 PM   #21 (permalink)
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i rarely have a difference of opinion with him. the one thing i can remember not agreeing about was science diet Z/D which is novel protein. to his knowledge, there was no other novel protein food in existence. this is not true. i didn't think he was stupid and lying to me, i just figured he didn't know about it and didn't have time to research (or just hadn't) cat food.
Z/D is not a novel protein...it's actually chicken liver. It is hydrolyzed...broken down into it's amino acid components...so part of the digestion process is already done, making it easier for the cat to complete the digestion. As far as I know, there are no other non-prescription equivalents to this food on the market. The limited ingredient diets and things like EVO venison or Hound & Gatos rabbit etc. are not the same thing.

That said, most cats don't need to go nearly as far as Z/D takes it and it bothers me that vets jump right to a food like this without trying the intermediate ones like basic grain free, LID or novel proteins. I see Z/D as the last ditch try when everything else has failed.

And from personal experience, Z/D smells really, really bad...
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:54 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I always listen, research and do what I want. Same with my doctors. It is "practising medicine." No absolutes.
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:34 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Z/D is not a novel protein...it's actually chicken liver. It is hydrolyzed...broken down into it's amino acid components...so part of the digestion process is already done, making it easier for the cat to complete the digestion. As far as I know, there are no other non-prescription equivalents to this food on the market. The limited ingredient diets and things like EVO venison or Hound & Gatos rabbit etc. are not the same thing.

That said, most cats don't need to go nearly as far as Z/D takes it and it bothers me that vets jump right to a food like this without trying the intermediate ones like basic grain free, LID or novel proteins. I see Z/D as the last ditch try when everything else has failed.

And from personal experience, Z/D smells really, really bad...
you're right, i remember reading "hydrolyzed" in the composition, but when i asked him to explain it, he couldn't very well LOL (guess hill's didn't pay very well that time). he just said it scrambled the protein molecules so that the body wasn't able to identify it (?) which is partially correct i suppose but in any case, whenever a doctor (or vet) isn't fully able to explain to me why something works, there's a pretty good chance i won't try it. he also didn't sound very hopeful when he added, "if she'll eat it."

by novel protein i meant brands like addiction and ziwipeak, or even the rabbit hound & gatos (which seems to be like gold--i am almost never able to get it, it's back-ordered everywhere so it must be popular)--stuff like kangaroo or new zealand brush tail, something the cat has never eaten before.

i have the same attitude: start with the simplest approach and work up. i tried science diet a long time ago and my cats never liked it, even just the plain. it didn't smell terrible but it was nondescript mush. i would imagine anything with partially digested chicken liver would smell revolting. i didn't even know this then but she would never have eaten it. all my cats hate liver.
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Old 02-23-2013, 06:41 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I've never been recommended a food for my cats by any vet I've gone to. The tech always asks me what I'm feeding. I tell them and they say, I've NEVER heard of that food! Yeah, I knorw, let's move on, LOL. They ask me how to spell it, I do and its on to the next subject. When I got my first cat I asked them what to feed, they said, whatever. I then asked them to give me a guidelines of a good food. Eh, anything. I realized my vet wasnt the one to ask about food from then on.

The only time I took a vets suggestions is when my dog was vomiting 4 times a week and losing weight They put him on a fish and potato diet. Cone to find he can't tolerate fish :/ when he went in for a check, they said, well we put you on a prescriptions diet but for SOME reason, you took him off. That's the only time i all but yelled at my vet that it made him a million times worse and he was vomiting 7 times a week not only 4. They said I should have come back for another prescription, sorry, not paying $30 for 5 lbs of food yeah, never taking their suggestions again
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:58 AM   #25 (permalink)
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rabbit hound & gatos (which seems to be like gold--i am almost never able to get it, it's back-ordered everywhere so it must be popular)
More like supply shortage than popularity...rabbit is one of those proteins that is always in short supply. Makes no sense when rabbits multiply like crazy
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:28 PM   #26 (permalink)
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But, if you could find a vet that was knowledgeable about nutrition AND was great "where it counts" wouldn't changing be a great idea? I think something as basic as nutrition is "where it counts". Lots of illnesses and issues are caused/cured by nutrition. If they don't understand that basic idea, then what good are they?
If I were choosing between two otherwise equally good vets and one had a solid understanding of nutrition and the other didn't, of course I would choose the knowledgeable nutritionist.

I've never been in a position where I had that many qualified veterinary options, though, so I've had to accept that I can't have everything in a vet.

That being the case, I would choose the better diagnostician over the most knowledgeable about nutrition (assuming neither vet was the best at both skills) because I can research and choose diet for my own household much more easily than I can diagnose and treat illness myself.
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Old 02-24-2013, 06:19 PM   #27 (permalink)
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I had a vet tell me that they strongly prefer dry food. When I asked why, they said it contains more nutrients. Wow. How many years of school and that's the best reason they can come up with??

I nicely explained my reasoning for feeding wet food (less fillers and grains, higher protein, much higher moisture content etc) and said that, of course, it really depends on the brand that you feed and ingredients. The vet said I should add some kibble into their diet but couldn't give me any real reasons for doing so. Won't be going back to that vet!
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Old 02-24-2013, 07:18 PM   #28 (permalink)
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I had a vet tell me that they strongly prefer dry food.
I had this happen with Simon so it'd be about 7-8 years ago. The reason the vet gave me back then was that in cats who are susceptible to teeth plaque or tartar (can't remember which), the wet food can exacerbate the condition.

I think most vets have changed their tune since then.
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Old 02-24-2013, 08:20 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Vet thinks grain-free is a fad

The first vet I took my cats two said this. They said its s marketing scheme and grain free was a fad. She said it is too high in protein and calories causing weight gain. That was just when I said grain free dry. When I said I switched them to wet she shook her head and said I'm setting them up for illness... Rotten teeth and other 'health issues' that she didn't mention(because there are none). I got into a heated argument that lead to no where and just made me frustrated. I was also pushed into a prescription diet for a short time and when I said it didn't work she called me a liar and said I'm killing my cats by feeding them a high protein food. I haven't taken them to a vet since.


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