Dry cat food, especially some cheap dry cat food brands, can greatly increase the chance of a cat developing urinary problems (especially crystals), particularly if the cat is predisposed to having the condition.

 

I can't cite any references at the moment, but I remember reading some evidence that suggests that corn in cat food can contribute to these type of problems. Many kitties do like their corn though . I suggest using a lot of can food - do your research and find a good brand with no fillers.

 

Sorry, I'm new to these issues... so crystals can cause a cat to pee in the house?


yes, the canned food I've been giving is Natura brand 95% meat. Is that good?

 

Developing crystals in the urine is a likely cause to inappropriate urination. It causes them pain and sometimes they associate the pain with the litter pan, as bizarre as that sounds.

Putting them on the cheapest wet food is always better than dry food. Cats are desert animals so they ingest water WITH their food so even providing a fountain with the dry food is not enough. They're not going to drink enough water to prevent kidney probs.

One of the names here for dry food is 'kitty crack'. They purposely put stuff in the dry food to attract cats to it since it's not 'natural' food. They also purposely make it salty so that cats will feel the urge to drink more water. But it's like going to the theatre for their salty popcorn and downing more cola to get rid of the thirst. Not natural or healthy.

 

Thank you everyone, for your most helpful replies.

Yes, I notice the cats do crave the dry (especially the boyz) and its like a drug to them. It also makes them very demanding and "naughty" in the sense of they get into more trouble and try to get my attention in order to get me to feed them more crack. When they only have wet food, they are much easier to live with!

So, update is I took the female the vet today. Bloodwork showed her kidneys are still good (great news, as she is at least 12 years old) and she is NOT diabetic. The vet does not think she has a UTI, so chose not to do a needle stick to collect urine at this time, as its a stressful procedure. (I'll never get a catch-sample on this cat).

As I described the dynamic in the house (the boy cats harass the female relentlessly) the vet thinks the issue is stress related, so we are going to do some logistics around here to keep the female safer from the boys.

The vet also provided us with a feli-away (?) difuser to help her stress levels, and an Rx for amatryptaline (sp?) which is also supposed to help.

What do you all think?

And the dry kibble is going to be fed to the chickens now.

 

If there's stress especially between cats, there's reason for a Feliway diffuser. Agree with that part, for sure.

 

Any cheap food can cause all sorts of issues, from allergies that really vex the poor baby to kidney stones and UTIs. Garbage in causes problems and grief to pets and owners alike.

 

Thank you again!
The cheap kibble will be chicken feed.
I've learned my lesson from you all!


Here's another question...
Is it possible the Feliway is working in just a couple of hours?
I just went in to visit the kitty in her room, and rather than pacing the floor, wanting out the door, she flopped on her back purring, asking for a tummy rub.
She has not acted like that in a long time! Is this the diffuser?

 

I swear by the Feliway. The boys were finally starting to get along so I let mine run out a few months ago.... I was just complaining to a co worker this morning about what a PitA MowMow has been for WEEKS and then I realized..... ohhhhhhhhhh, the freaking Feliway. I should have known better than to go without... he's such a monster.

 

How big an area does the Feliway work in? Do I need one in the living room, as well as the bathroom where Kelsey kitty has her "apartment" of her own.

 

Here's another question... will the feliway have any effect on our dogs too? One of our dogs sure could use some calming influences!

Of course, if this works so well for the cats, I should get the canine version for the dogs, aye?

Any of you have experience with the doggy version?

 

I'm reading some scary stuff on Amazon about the doggy diffusers getting hot and melting! Anyone had the problem with the Feliways?

 

A friend of mine had hers start dripping the Feliway refill liquid and it damaged her floor. But it was a very old dispenser. So occasionally replace the plug in. Like every couple years. All of us use the plug in dispensers and that is the only problem we’ve encountered. I wouldn’t worry.

For now we seem to have fixed the problems. I have not filled the Rx for the amatryptaline, and hope to avoid that if not needed.

My feeling is meds that sedate a cat are the last resort. I’ve had good results using Composure Liquid by Vetri Science. Syringe each morning and evening into their mouth. It’s all natural. You can buy it on the internet cheaper than from a vet.

 

I haven't had a problem. I do need to replace the diffuser itself pretty soon though... it's been almost two years and it's starting to look dirty and gross.

Never tried the dog one.

 

Update:
Thank you all for your help and advice.

For now we seem to have fixed the problems.
We have all cats on canned food (cheap kibble is going to the chickens.)
I've put a Feliway diffuser in the bathroom, where I put the elderly female kitty at night. She is MUCH more relaxed. I have not filled the Rx for the amatryptaline, and hope to avoid that if not needed.
No one seems to be peeing anywhere "illegal" for the last couple of weeks.
All kitties are being quite civilized with each other... only very occasional naughtiness.

Thanks for your help!

 

I will have to disagree due to this:

My 1 year old female cat was just diagnosed, today, with crystals in her urine. She was straining in her box & was only getting a dime size out. Mind you, I have been feeding her 90% canned EVO which was recommended on here & is a high quality food. Plus, I was feeding her 10% EVO dry food. She is now labeled to have feline lower urinary tract disease & is on prescription Purina UR.

My vet said that I was definitely feeding her a high quality food & he would never tell someone to stop feeding that brand unless the cat is having issues with crystals. He said that some cats just can't break down the minerals that are in food.

She is my only cat. I had 2 males before her & they have since passed. My KC also had FLUTD & had a blocked bladder 3 times at the age of 2 years old. We wound up getting him the PU surgery & he was on a prescription diet & did really well on it for 12 years. Sadly, I had to put him down in March at almost 14 years old. He got a bad UTI & then his body was resisting the medicines & the vet discovered that he had disk degeneration disease which caused him alot of pain.

I didn't mean to hijack your thread but I wanted to let you know my experience. I honestly don't think that it matters what kind of food you feed them in regards to trying to prevent urinary issues. Those are most likely due to genetics, stress, obesity etc. However, if my cat didn't have these issues, I would absolutely keep feeding her that high quality food.

One more thing that my vet told me is that Shadow can develop urinary issues later in her life.




Sent from Petguide.com Free App

 

Soccer girl, I really disagree with you.

For people, if you are predisposed to heart disease, a healthy diet and lifestyle reduce your risk. Same with cats and their health issues. Just because you are predisposed, you don't life off of McDonald's and bacon. Its all about reducing risk, but you can never prevent completely. Saying food has no affect is not only dangerous but inaccurate.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App

 

I also have to agree with this and disagree with you too soccergirl, for the same reason stated above. Yes, some cats are more prone to urinary issues, no matter what they eat. But I do agree that MANY of the problems with crystals and other issues is based on the diet.

I know EVO is a decent food, but I have never been that impressed with it, and many cats don't like it, which is enough for me to not use it. I am a big lover of Wellness grain free, no fish ones, and with water mixed in the food.

I'm glad things are getting better, and glad kitty is not peeing out of the box. I have two of my cats put up at night, otherwise they are naughty, and if they are up, they sleep. I think kitty might be more relaxed in her bathroom with no one to bother her. Glad things are getting better.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again... lower quality foods are not like McDonalds. They have the correct essential vitamins and minerals added, which McDonalds does not. Most people do feed lower quality foods by and large once you no longer are on a site like this, and if a problem arises, then of course they will need to change the diet to meet the correct needs of the situation (much like someone that ends up with celiac disease -- it's genetic -- must now avoid grain; everyone else doesn't need to). If it was like McDonalds I can say that my cat would not be alive today at near 18, as well as many many cats I know of (700+) that are fed this food at the cat sanctuary. Sure, someone may live for awhile on McDonalds, but day in and out on the exact same stuff, this would not lead to a long life in most cases.

I totally agree that higher quality food is ideal, but if you can't afford it you aren't setting your cat up for an early death just because of food, unless of course health complications arise that prompt a dietary change. I'd be thrilled if there were concrete studies done to back up the claims that a food like Friskies wet food is substantially more likely to lead to a UTI than a food like EVO but until then I'm not particularly seeing anything beyond genetics playing their part, and once diagnosed, going on a food low in phosphorus and magnesium would be important.

soccergrl, I'm sorry to hear about your problems. Were you feeding 95% chicken and turkey? It is a fairly low in phosphorus food already. I wish your kitty the best, I lost a cat at three years of age due to UTI problems back when vets didn't even suggest surgery options and when these more expensive foods didn't even exist, as far as I'm aware.

 

One of "those" cats.

My Max was one of those cats that no diet of any type made any difference and he ended up having the PU surgery. It was horrible. Then for years after that he had periods of bleeding and pain. Urinalysis revealed struvite crystals and sometimes (tho not always) urinary tract infections. Finally, my vet said he thought it might be stress related (my 3300 sq ft house in the country was built with floor to ceiling windows specifically for the pleasure of my cats, so this was a particularly stunning theory to me). He was put on a mild tranquilizer, but I wasn't happy about how it seemed to make him seem so miserable, so we stopped those. So, since the episodes of bleeding (which lasted about 3 months for each occurrence) were intermittent, I started paying special attention to common denominators for each occurrence and it ended up being the same thing each time it happened and that was if I was away from the house for more than one night at a time. Even tho my mother would come and feed them three times a day and spend a little time watching TV with them, it seemed to be being left alone overnight that would trigger the episode of bleeding (the other cat showed no signs of stress) and sure enough Max would meet me at the head of the stairs upon my return, meowing long and hard at me as tho he was yelling at me.

After that, I hired a cat sitter to spend the night, every night that I have been gone and he has never bled again (and we have been through divorce, moving twice and remarriage). The last bleeding incident was 6 years ago. I would be interested in other studies related to stubborn cases of struvite crystal manufacturing and stress in cats.
View attachment 16074

 

I would be interested in other studies related to stubborn cases of struvite crystal manufacturing and stress in cats.

That would be an interesting study as well, there's lots of factors behind the buildup to conditions. Every body is going to react to foods differently, too... whether the foods are "good" or "bad".

Another thing I wanted to add was, if it seems more cats get crystals when on cheaper food, I'd be very interested in seeing a large proper breakdown of the facts... the numbers are going to be in pointing towards it for causing crystals based on the majority feeding it until a controlled study is done.

A lot of lower quality foods actually have lower prosperous I've noticed (Canned Food Data USA)... so they may even be better for a cat with crystal buildup problems, especially compared to that Before Grain quail that all my cats love (it's the second highest on the list!).

 

This is making me nervous. My cat had the PU surgery less than a year ago, and he's on a diet of just wet food (mostly Evo 95% chick+turk). I initially had him on the prescription diet, but I switched over. I'm still nervous that stopping the prescription diet was a bad idea.

Can they sell get blockages even after the surgery?

 

Don't think so



Molldee, I don't think they will get blockages after the PU surgery (which should be a last resort for cats that the diet is ineffective with), but they will still make crystals. UTI's are still pretty common post PU.

 

Carmel, I've thought about the mcdonald's analogy a fair amount, (and for the record, i'm not getting involved in cat food wars, i'm Switzerland. what all of yous feed your cats is your own business--jus' whatever lol) and I've decided that the analogy isn't apt either, except for the craving. mcdonalds sprays sugar on everything--even their French fries, so not only is it not nutritionally complete but it has additives that make people crave bad food. animal digest and a lot of what they put in/on dry cat food would be the equivalent--it's not good food or species appropriate, but the cats just love it and ask for it by name. LOL sugar, fat and salt for humans. i don't know what that equals in cats. but if you stop eating that stuff, the craving stops as well, so maybe the same thing happens with cats. something else crosses my mind: fast food isn't exactly cheap. sure, there's the dollar menu, but seriously: what kind of fish is a DOLLAR and that begs the question, why would anyone want to eat it?

grocery store dry cat food (and even fancy feast, probably. i don't know what's in it, all i know is that i can't make that magic gravy at home. at this point, i probably don't even want to know.) is more the equivalent of ramen noodles with vitamins, minerals and taurine added. if they were enhanced, you could eat it the rest of your life, you wouldn't die of malnutrition or get scurvy or rickets, but neither would you be in top form. there was something on the news that showed ramen noodles basically passing through the digestive tract unchanged. if they actually had vitamins/minerals/amino acids added, they would be acceptable. as they are, they really would be bad to try to live on long-term, but I've been there, probably like everyone as a student. you buy a lot of them after you've paid all your bills and you won't die of starvation. then you get a better job after you graduate and you never buy them again lol. (except you know what? they are kind of good to eat dry instead of potato chips. )

 

Maybe a better analogy would be Kraft Dinner (or Kraft Macaroni and Cheese to you yankees). It's loaded with all the "essentials" and technically you could live on it, but it's a far cry from the "real thing", if you know what I mean.

but if you stop eating that stuff, the craving stops as well, so maybe the same thing happens with cats.

Two little girls my mom works with used to come over and play with Io last year (because they wanted a kitty of their own). One day, as a "treat", the littlest one brought a can of Friskies over to feed her - she had spent her allowance on it (cheap parents lol). I figured Friskies was what we fed her when we first brought her home, and the little girls were so cute, one crappy meal wouldn't hurt her. So we go ahead, she sniffs it distastefully but eventually eats about half and the little girls are happy.

Four hours later, the house stinks, there's poo on her butt, and the farts... oh god, the farts... I still have nightmares.

So whether the "craving" goes away... probably, she used to love Friskies. But her guts definately aren't equipped to handle that crap anymore. Like me and McDonalds. Or Kraft Dinner, for that matter.

 

Thanks for the link Carmel! Makes me wonder if I should include one of those cheaper foods in my rotation just for that super low phosphorus level.... :| does anyone do that?? Feeds things like Evo one day and Friskies another??


Sent from Petguide.com Free App

 

Thanks for the link Carmel! Makes me wonder if I should include one of those cheaper foods in my rotation just for that super low phosphorus level.... :| does anyone do that?? Feeds things like Evo one day and Friskies another??

You're welcome.

I used to try, but Blaze is old and fussy. He's lived on Friskies wet food along with Meowmix or whatever other cheap kibble was on sale (we did manage to upgrade kibble a year or two ago), and finding him turn his nose up at the expensive wet stuff more than half the time was very much not worth my time or money.

I wouldn't recommend switching between higher and lower foods unless it's due to budget constraints; the cat may go on hunger strikes for Friskies and there are better foods than Friskies that are low in phosphorus -- Solid Gold chicken, whitefish, and liver is the lowest regular food, and looks to be a good food. I know there's the whole importance to avoid fish thing, but whatever is going on for this one seems to make it work to keep phosphorus down (uncertain about the magnesium but the phosphorus should be an indicator, right?).

Plus, if UTI aren't a concern for your cat, feeding it regular foods with their phosphorus percentages shouldn't be a problem, none of them should be horrendously out of wack to cause issues unless you're cat is predispised, especially is you feed in rotation various foods. That's how I look at it, anyway. Which is also sort of how I look at lower quality foods as well -- if it's working for your cat and all is well as far as a veterinarian can tell, no need to change. Opinions on what's important are changing all the time anyway. (Coffee, good/bad? :lol

 

Very interesting topic, and when I look at all the cats I know/I've owned in my life, my family is the only ones feeding a higher quality wet food, and that's only recent. Everyone else is meow mix, or friskies wet, and though there cats tend towards obesity, they've lived 8+ years.

We free fed out first cat low quality dry, and she lived at least 12 years, maybe more. Our other girl lived 11 originally free fed dry, then later switched to friskies wet meals because she became overweight. Neither cat ever had UTI's, the overweight girl started going in the dirty laundry by the end of her days, but she was going through kidney failure.

I think high quality wet food is less about prolonging your cats life, but more about giving them a higher quality of life, if your cat will eat it. I mean, the healthier you are, the happier you are.

 

I think high quality wet food is less about prolonging your cats life, but more about giving them a higher quality of life, if your cat will eat it. I mean, the healthier you are, the happier you are.

I agree, yet also disagree.

What's healthy is relative... we can't asks the cats if they feel "healthier" on different foods. While I'm aware there are reports of cats on lower quality foods with dandruff/low energy/vomiting etc. there are also tons, the majority I'd say when judging by the cat sanctuary, that have none of these problems. They look healthy and act healthy. I'm not going to base my opinions hypothetically on what may be going on inside their bodies, I'll just use my own eyes, you look how you feel is a pretty good indicator.

Something else of note: the cats at the sanctuary are free fed dry (along with meals of Friskies wet) and the vast majority are not obese, or even overweight. I can think of maybe 10 out of 700+ cats that are obese there. I attribute this problem mainly (in cats) to lifestyle or underlying health issues, not food.

Talking about diets, the really serious ones are the ones certain cultures of people eat, they end up with heart disease and obesity at young ages. Here we are obsessing over cat foods (I'm totally guilty of this ) when really, compared to what many humans eat, these cat foods are at least formulated to meet nutrional needs! Most of them aren't dying at young ages, but the same can't be said for people. We're the ones in trouble...

 

soccergrl, I'm sorry to hear about your problems. Were you feeding 95% chicken and turkey? It is a fairly low in phosphorus food already. I wish your kitty the best, I lost a cat at three years of age due to UTI problems back when vets didn't even suggest surgery options and when these more expensive foods didn't even exist, as far as I'm aware.[/QUOTE]

Yes that is what I was feeding her. The crazy thing is that my cat is a female & is slightly blocked due to crystals & doesn't have a UTI.

My cat KC, who was male, was blocked with crystals. I think that I am just unlucky with cats. Shadow is definitely our last one that we will own.




Sent from Petguide.com Free App

 

Shadow is definitely our last one that we will own.

This makes me sad, a little

off-topic...

Very interesting topic, and when I look at all the cats I know/I've owned in my life, my family is the only ones feeding a higher quality wet food, and that's only recent. Everyone else is meow mix, or friskies wet, and though there cats tend towards obesity, they've lived 8+ years.

Not lucky for the cats, but lucky for you. My sister aside, the cat-owners I know all feed raw pucks and I get the smallest of stinkeyes when they see the Evo. :roll:

 

What are signs of a UTI? Should I clean his area everytime I see him go to the bathroom? Are any foods or ingredients known to cause UTIs?

Oh and he had the surgery because since he was one, he blocked for times.

 

What are signs of a UTI? Should I clean his area everytime I see him go to the bathroom? Are any foods or ingredients known to cause UTIs?

Oh and he had the surgery because since he was one, he blocked for times.

Our Missy gets UT infections about once a year or so. She will squat and pee tiny amounts that are tinged with blood. I normally first notice it when I wipe the puddle up with a paper towel, then I watch her closely. She will just stop, lift her tail and dribble bloody pee here and there, making frequent trips to the litter box too. It's painful too, so the vet has given me tiny vials of pain meds in case it flairs up over a weekend and I can't get her in right away. When she does have a flair up she gets an antibiotic injection then another in 2 weeks. This is the only recurring health issue we have with the 5 cats.

 

Even aside from urinary issues.... when you look at the ingredients of the really crappy stuff how can you in good conscience (if you can afford better) feed that to your cat? Would you put that crap in YOUR mouth? Why put it in your cat when their body is even less equipped to deal with that crap than ours?

I understand that lots of people are just doing the best htey can, but imho the majority are NOT and the 'best you can' often doesn't put their pet's health (and food) into a very high priority into their budget.

Here's the first 8 ingredients in Meow Mix (dry):
Whole ground corn, chicken by-product meal, corn gluten meal, soybean meal, whole wheat, animal fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), animal digest, corn syrup

Here's the full ingredient list for Evo (Canned):
Chicken, Chicken Broth, Turkey, Natural Flavor, Carrageenan, Minerals (Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Potassium Iodide), Guar Gum, Vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Niacin Supplement, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin Supplement, Folic Acid, Biotin), Choline Chloride, Herring Oil, Salt, Potassium Chloride, Sodium Ascorbate (Source of Vitamin C), Taurine, Sunflower Oil, Sodium Phosphate, Beta Carotene