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Discussion Starter #1
I am thinking of buying a grinder mainly for grinding bones.
I am thinking like thighs, turkey wings, chicken back, duck back etc.

Right now, Mui Mui is 5 months old, and she should be given whatever she wants to eat. But she can only chew quail ribs, or quail necks if she is in the mood. And Cheetah has been very lazy on chewing bone, and he only chews quail bone, maybe 2 pieces of 1 inch pieces at most for each meal. He will not even eat chicken wingtips. Of course he will not chew larger pieces of bone-in quail.

So I have been cutting meat, quail, liver and organ in about 1 inch pieces and mix well. I know Cheetah will not eat all bones, so I add some calcium. The amount is little enough some they don't smell it, so it is not enough to make up the bones that Cheetah does not eat.

I am thinking of getting a grinder, and grind half of their bone. For example, if I need 2 lbs of bone in my batch I am making, 1 lb will come from pieces of quail, and another lb will be from grounded bones (of course with correct calculation). Be able to ground bones will also reduce my expense, since chicken/turkey wings provide more bone than whole quail and is much cheaper. And be able to ground chicken wings will give them more skin, which is what they do not have much now.
Cheetah is really bad about eating hearts too, so I am thinking of grinding half of the hearts too. Others will still be in pieces.

Any suggestions or comments? And any recommendation on the brand and model of grinder?
 

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You can if you want. If you can spend some money a fair amount of raw feeders, that grind, use a Tasin grinder http://www.onestopjerkyshop.com/tasin-ts108-electric-meat-grinder-p-47.html?osCsid=4eadbd6da5fe436a22d163b0076a27bb. I believe they are one of the few that don't void a warranty if bones are ground, in fact the descriptions they write usually includes a blurb about barf diets. Some other fair quality ginders should do ok, but if you run into problems they may void the warranty if they find out bones were run through the machine. If you want to go super cheap, and don't mind the elbow grease, the old manual food grinders (common names are universal and griswold) will go through bone . I recommend you get the largest, or #3 Universal grinder, if your grinding bone ( http://cgi.ebay.com/Universal-Food-Meat-Chopper-No-3-Original-Box-/170568318897?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27b6a9ffb1 you can find them cheaper).

Good luck
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you, Chris, for your advice.
I tried to go to supermarkets and see if they can grind wings or backs for me, and they said no, and looked at me like I am crazy.

I guess I will have to buy a grinder. Cheetah is eating very little bone, his poo is still hard, but I am still worried.

I will probably think about TS108 or TS110, or Weston #22 if I really have to.
 

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I use the Waring Pro to grind my food and I love it.
 

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I am very puzzled by this raw bone feeding.
How does cat digest bone?
I gave my cat finely smashed raw bone, but he seemed to want to vomit it out in the morning.
Then I pureed chicken bone into paste, which feels a bit sandy, and then my cat got acute diarrhea for 3 days, which scared the **** out of me. The vet said the bones hurt his digestive lining. Now I don't even know if I should give him any more bones, and he seems to like cooked chicken more than raw chicken meat.
Are your cats fine after eating grinded chickens?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I am very puzzled by this raw bone feeding.
How does cat digest bone?
I gave my cat finely smashed raw bone, but he seemed to want to vomit it out in the morning.
Then I pureed chicken bone into paste, which feels a bit sandy, and then my cat got acute diarrhea for 3 days, which scared the **** out of me. The vet said the bones hurt his digestive lining. Now I don't even know if I should give him any more bones, and he seems to like cooked chicken more than raw chicken meat.
Are your cats fine after eating grinded chickens?
No, I have no problem feeding bones before.
I have been feeding raw for 1 year, and mainly quail bones in their diet. I cut quail into about 1 inch x 1 inch square or larger, and they have no problem chewing, breaking, swallowing, digesting bone (when they want to).

I have not fed grinded bones before, but I am looking into it. The commercial raw I sometimes feed has bone meal in it.

I saw your other post, it could be because the bone is slightly cooked, or there is too much bone in the diet.

Why don't you try commercial raw first, and then if you are going to make your own raw, then use a grinder to grind up the RAW bones.
 

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I feed frankenprey (whole body parts, including wings, ribs, etc.) and not ground, so I don't actually have anything to offer on the original topic, but I wanted to respond to Hobbes' post for those reading this who aren't familiar with his situation.

I am very puzzled by this raw bone feeding.
How does cat digest bone?
I gave my cat finely smashed raw bone, but he seemed to want to vomit it out in the morning.
Then I pureed chicken bone into paste, which feels a bit sandy, and then my cat got acute diarrhea for 3 days, which scared the **** out of me. The vet said the bones hurt his digestive lining. Now I don't even know if I should give him any more bones, and he seems to like cooked chicken more than raw chicken meat.
Are your cats fine after eating grinded chickens?
Hobbes, the commercial raw product you've been feeding your cat has an unspecified amount of bone in it; my guess, however, is that there is more than there should be/needs to be, and that your added bone-in meals have contributed to your kitty being constipated.

As for the digestive injury, that was due to feeding cooked bone, which should never, ever be done.

Raw bones are flexible and soft and easily digested by the cat, regardless of their form (whole, cut or ground).

AC
 

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I think you are right that the injury was scrached by the cooked bone however finely I pureed it. Originally I assumed bones can dissolve in stomach acid. Since many cats eat raw bone, and the bones don't seem to come out from the other end, it means the bones must have dissolved in their bodies. That is why I thought it was ok to puree half cooked bone. (It is kinda too bloody and smelly to puree raw bone).
I really wanna try raw diet again, but my vet told me raw diet would cause chronic bowl inflammation. Do you think it might??
 

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Hey again Hobbes :) It may be intensely bloody and smelly, but you must must must must MUST feed *raw* bone/meat. Due to squeemishness, I had a horrible time when I first gave my cats a cute, fluffy 1-day old chick, and I was also shocked at the amount of blood/red matter that came out of the raw chicken leg (drumstick), but I quickly got used to it. So, push yourself to put up with it. Afterall, you're doing it for your cat :)
 

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Thank you, I will check the raw diet website you gave me.
One day old chicks sound like a good idea since the bones are real soft. Maybe my cat have trouble digesting hard adult chicken bones.:? He is afraid of mice and birds though, so maybe I still need to chop them......
 

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I think you are right that the injury was scrached by the cooked bone however finely I pureed it. Originally I assumed bones can dissolve in stomach acid. Since many cats eat raw bone, and the bones don't seem to come out from the other end, it means the bones must have dissolved in their bodies. That is why I thought it was ok to puree half cooked bone. (It is kinda too bloody and smelly to puree raw bone).
I really wanna try raw diet again, but my vet told me raw diet would cause chronic bowl inflammation. Do you think it might??
Sadly a lot of vets are not well-educated on animal nutrition. This is going to sound like a conspiracy theory, but this comes straight from the mouth of several trained vets I know personally, and was echoed in greater detail by the vet/nutritionist who wrote the book I linked in that other thread:
Basically, vets get maybe one semester, or one or two classes on nutrition, usually taught by a representative from a major pet food company (Science Diet, Iams, etc.). So not only is the subject not covered much, but what they do learn about it is taught by a very biased instructor. Of course these companies are going to teach them that raw food is bad, because these companies don't want people feeding cats raw diets, they want them buying their expensive prescription and premium diets.

So unfortunately a lot of vets just don't know any better, and believe a lot of inaccurate myths perpetuated about raw, because this is what they've been taught.

And then (this is what I've heard several pro-raw vets say) a lot who are actually educated on raw are still often hesitant to recommend homemade raw diets because of the propensity for people to take shortcuts or not do proper research. It's definitely a diet you have to approach from a well-informed perspective, with ample research done beforehand. And sadly sometimes people don't do that which can lead to nutritional deficiencies, sometimes serious ones.

So anyway, that's my not-so-short summary on why vets frequently discourage raw diets.

I definitely don't understand why a raw diet would cause chronic bowel inflammation. If anything I think it'd do the opposite. Cats have very short, acidic digestive tracts which are designed to extract nutrients from their food and push it through their systems very rapidly. This is easy for it to do with the readily bio-available nutrients in raw meat. Unfortunately cooked meat, or any highly processed food, makes it more difficult for them to extract the nutrients they need. The digestive system has to work harder to break down these foods, and that can cause stomach irritation or digestive upset in sensitive cats.

My younger cat Athena has gas and soft, stinky stools (basically, classic irritable bowel symptoms) any time she eats processed food. The more processed the food, the worse it is (kibble with grain in it leaves her horribly bloated). The only time she's ever had 100% normal stools have been when she's on a pure raw diet. I was originally a skeptic about the supposed miraculous effects of a raw diet, but the results have really been amazing and now that I've read up on cat digestion, it makes a lot of sense.

As for the gross blood and stuff, I sympathize. I'm a vegetarian, specifically because meat grosses me out so much. You should have seen me the first time I was cutting meat off a raw chicken drumstick. My boyfriend was laughing at me because I kept exclaiming things like, "Oh my god, what are these noodly things? Are these veins?! Oh man, I just cut some of the bone and it's bleeding! Oh this is so gross!"

I've gotten a little more used to it with time. Though honestly I don't think I could grind anything myself. That would be too much for me. Any time I think about it, I just have flashbacks to Sweeny Todd (I'm a wimp about anything remotely horror-film-esque).

If you're grossed out by grinding you may have a lot easier time with just doing whole prey or frankenprey (meat and organ chunks with meaty bone). It sounds odd but somehow it grosses me out less because it's all more...in-tact. You just need to make sure you ease them into that at their own pace since sometimes it can take them a while to build up the jaw strength and skills to handle meat chunks, bone, and whole prey, if they've been used to kibble and/or canned food for a while.
 

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Thank you, I will check the raw diet website you gave me.
One day old chicks sound like a good idea since the bones are real soft. Maybe my cat have trouble digesting hard adult chicken bones.:? He is afraid of mice and birds though, so maybe I still need to chop them......
Hehe, I think you just need to re-ignite his instincts. And yes, the bones are very soft and small - he should really have no trouble with them. My 8 month old kitten has been adeptly eating day-old chicks since we got her in August. It's worth a try :) Please let me know if you'd like any advice on feeding them - I'm happy to help!
 

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Thanks for the advice from everyone!
Do you add any suppliment to raw preys?
And I am worried about worms. Would cats get worms from raw food?
I just saw many gory pictures of worms growing in human brain because they ate too much sashimi....Could cats get that?
 
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