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Discussion Starter #1
We're on week 3 and I'm using the formulated amount of bone for Mow.... but this week he's terribly constipated. He was meatloafed and squinty eyed and not wanting to play and run around.

He's still eating fine so for breakfast and dinner today I gave him canned food and this morning he got a tablespoon of pumpkin mixed in with LOTS of extra water both times. This afternoon he pooped (either that or an elephant used his box) and then went bonkers running around and playing for a good 3 hours.

I don't want to give him canned each time he gets bound up...should I just skip one of his bone meals when it happens or cut back on the % of bone he's getting to prevent it?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Chicken wings.... .93 ounces every Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday (to equal 2.8 per week).
 

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Hmm...see I feed my girls bone three times a week as well (Mon/Weds/Fri), and it's about the same amount that you feed...usually it's chicken wings too. Samantha (my biggest) weighs about 11 lbs and Alice (the smallest) weighs about 8.5 lbs...never been a problem yet.

Do you have Mow on full raw yet Krissy? What I do to help curb possible constipation from bone is, the day after the bone dinner, they get a liver or kidney meal...organs are supposed to be stool softeners, so I assume I'm helping to balance that out a bit.
 

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Whee, look at me, I'm quoting myself! :wiggle

Do you have Mow on full raw yet Krissy?
I only ask, because if he's still getting canned, you may want to lessen the amount of bone you give him. Canned is meant to be nutritionally complete, so he may be getting more calcium than he needs.
 

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This is a useful topic for me. Athena's sometimes a little constipated after her chicken wings. Since their normal food is Primal, do you think it's the same issue as it would be with canned, Time Bandit? The Primal is supposed to be completely balanced already, and does contain ground bone, although they say you can feed raw meaty bones with it.

So a pure meat and/or organ meal around the bone meal might be a good fix for issues like this?
 

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Obviously I'm no expert...but I'd say yes, the Primal, just like the canned, is already nutritionally balanced so any extra bone-in meals you give would have to be accounted for, and portions reduced.

I would think it would help to pad the bone-in meals with a bit of organ...I see it as a healthy balance sort of thing. Like I said, thats what I do, and I've really never had a problem with constipation. Then again, I know every cat is different...but it it's happening to both of you, it couldn't hurt to try right? :) Chicken livers are pretty easy to get (I can get mine cheap at the grocery store) and they are good stool softeners...just make sure you don't overfeed or stools are going to be a lot softer than you (or the cat!) wanted! XD
 

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The only thing I worry about with the chicken livers is going overboard on vitamin A, since the Primal already contains liver as well. I'm not sure if additional liver would be too much?

What's interesting is it was only Athena who had issues, not Apollo, and Apollo ate way more bone than she did, so I guess every cat is different. XD

I'm also not 100% sure she was constipated, just kind of assumed, because she was meowing while using the litterbox that one time. She never does that. Would that be a sign of constipation? Or just her being weird?
 

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Honestly, I'm not sure what would have caused her mewing at the litter box. The only time Rochelle did it, was when she had her UTI. :?

But yeah, yer right, the Primal and the canned would have more than enough liver nutrients as well...duh to me...these half and half meals confuse me a bit, hehe. :p Yer other suggestion of an all-meat meal would probably work too. Just something to break up the bone meals.

Apollo sounds like Alice...she can eat anything in any amount and not have problems (garbage disposal! XD). Rochelle though, too much or too little of something, causes her problems with her stools, so I have to be incredibly picky with her, and the organ meals breaking up the bone-in meals seem to help with that.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
He's on full raw. The only reason he got canned that day was so I could add the pumpkin (he won't eat the pumpkin if I don't hide it) and a lot of water (I thought it might help to hydrate his innards :p).
 

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Of our 5 cats on raw the only one who has issues with constipation is Zaq (17). If he eats a boney meal with no meat, it's just too much and he actually has stool so hard it cuts his anus. :(

We remedy this by feeding smaller amounts of bone with meat, more often. As opposed to larger bone pieces less often. Since he is eating large chunks of meat as well, he still gets the dental benefits without getting a sore pooper. :)

Oops: Also, we give him fish oil or organ with large bone meals that don't have lots of meat.
 

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He's on full raw. The only reason he got canned that day was so I could add the pumpkin (he won't eat the pumpkin if I don't hide it) and a lot of water (I thought it might help to hydrate his innards :p).
Could it have been the pumpkin? That's used to add more fiber to a cat's diet to help firm up their stools, right? Maybe the combination of the pumpkin and the bone was too much.

Honestly, I'm not sure what would have caused her mewing at the litter box. The only time Rochelle did it, was when she had her UTI. :???:

But yeah, yer right, the Primal and the canned would have more than enough liver nutrients as well...duh to me...these half and half meals confuse me a bit, hehe. :razz: Yer other suggestion of an all-meat meal would probably work too. Just something to break up the bone meals.

Apollo sounds like Alice...she can eat anything in any amount and not have problems (garbage disposal! XD). Rochelle though, too much or too little of something, causes her problems with her stools, so I have to be incredibly picky with her, and the organ meals breaking up the bone-in meals seem to help with that.
Yeah, thankfully I don't think it's a UTI, as she's not shown any trouble in the litterbox since that one episode. Maybe it was just too much bone for her or maybe she was just being weird...hrm. She doesn't meow very often as-is, and I am always perplexed when she does because it's at the most random times. Whereas Apollo is constantly meowing.

And yeah, Apollo has a stomach of steel. Athena's the reason I started learning about raw in the first place, because she had constant digestive upsets on all other food. She also vomits if her food is too cold. Whereas Apollo can eat almost anything (including...lettuce apparently, as I accidentally discovered one day) and be just fine. The only thing that's ever given him trouble is raw beef.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Could it have been the pumpkin? That's used to add more fiber to a cat's diet to help firm up their stools, right? Maybe the combination of the pumpkin and the bone was too much.
I didn't give the canned food and pumpkin until AFTER I noticed he was constipated. That was the first time he's had pumpkin since I put him on raw.
 

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Whereas Apollo can eat almost anything (including...lettuce apparently, as I accidentally discovered one day) and be just fine.
Not to high-jack the thread, but I had to comment on this, cause it made me giggle. :p Apparently, Samantha likes lettuce too. She was all over my Chicken Supreme Gordita from Taco Bell (that means trying to grab my food or hand with her paw and pull it towards her...), and she got this mouthful of lettuce...it was gone in a second. I've been calling her Rabbit-cat. XD
 

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The actual full recommendation for bone-in meals is 5% to 10%, so, certainly, 10% can be too much bone for any given cat.

If you're cutting the wings up (mine get cut into three pieces, the wing tip is one, and the middle joint is cut in half horizontally between the two bones), just offer one piece less once or twice a week and see how that goes. If you get loose stools at any point, then you'll need to do as Muzby does and ofter smaller bone-in meals more often, so the cat is getting the same amount of bone, but spread out a little more evenly over the weekly period.

And, yep, anyone feeding any type of commercial foods has to account for that portion of the diet when calculating the raw meat/bone/organ percentages.

Regards!

AC
 

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Discussion Starter #17
So I have a bit of leeway in how much bone he needs to eat. I 'll stop panicking then. He seems to KNOW when he's had enough because he'd only eat the bone about twice a week and I'd have to smear the third days in parmesan to get him to eat it.

I should just learn to trust his instincts a bit more :p he seems to understand what he needs.
 

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Bone/Constipation

I transitioned Ritz to commercial raw about two weeks ago, mainly Primal Quail. She was always hungry on the 9(!) ounces of Fancy Feast (aka kitty crack) and 1/8 cup dry TOTW I was feeding her, and I hated the ingredients in FF. For numerous reasons, I think raw is the way to go. So far so good, although she is once again getting picky.
ANYWAY: two days later she pooped a tiny bit, very hard, blood on stool. She had an episode of colitis three months ago concurrent with a UTI. (Vet has ordered a urine and stool sample).
It was suggested by some posters on this and other sites that I substitute one ounce of Primal for one ounce of raw meat. Apparently Primal Quail has a high ratio of calcium to phosphate, or the way *I* understand it: a lot of bone. Hopefully that will cure the problem. Though being OCDish about diet and Ritz, I'm trusting she's not missing any nutrients she needs.
Did the constipation issue resolve itself? I'll remember the liver/kidney remedy. Ritz hates hates pumpkin and metamucil.
PS: she loved the chuck beef loin NY strip steak ($2 off!) I gave her. And on a per once basis, it was actually cheaper than one once of Primal. Gotta love those end of fresh date sales!
 

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I agree with Ritzpg that the commercial raw food has a lot of bone in it because it's cheaper. It's a good idea to add boneless meal from time to time while feeding the commercial raw.
 

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Yeah, what Aunt Crazy said. Like humans, no two cats are alike. The owner knows his/her cat the best; you know when something is "off". Take what you need and leave the rest (advice).
I meant no offense by my post and didn't mean to make blanket statements.
Constipation issue has resolved itself. Stool sample negative; urine sample came back positive for sturvite crystals. :fust
 
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