Welcome and how nice that they all seem to enjoy hanging together. I will leave the food recommendations to some others who know more than I do.

 

Oops, removed one of the pictures as I realized it has our address on full display on his tag. Any opinions would be welcome - I am not crazy about the chicken meal as the first ingredient.

 

Royal Canin is a terrible food. It was also recommended by a vet to give my foster dog Royal Canin Urinary S/O dry because she had crystals too. When I looked up the ingredients I said "no way" right away. It is very nutritionally unbalanced and can only imagine what could happen if on it long term.

If your cat is predisposed to get crystals, increasing water intake is the best way to go. Basically the only reason they recommend this food is because it's got added salt to increase thirst, at least that is what the vet said when I asked what the difference was of this food.

Ingredient list:

Brewers rice, corn, wheat, egg product, chicken fat, corn gluten meal, natural flavors, monocalcium phosphate, wheat gluten, fish oil, calcium carbonate, potassium chloride, fructooligosaccharides, salt, taurine, potassium citrate, L-lysine, vitamins [DL-alpha tocopherol acetate (source of vitamin E), inositol, niacin supplement, L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), D-calcium pantothenate, biotin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), riboflavin supplement, thiamine mononitrate (vitamin B1), vitamin A acetate, folic acid, vitamin B12 supplement, vitamin D3 supplement], choline chloride, trace minerals [zinc proteinate, zinc oxide, ferrous sulfate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, copper sulfate, calcium iodate, sodium selenite, copper proteinate], L-carnitine, marigold extract (Tagetes erecta L.), rosemary extract, preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid.

 

I would stay far, far away from the dry. Once you start feeding dry, he will most likely become addicted and will turn his nose up to wet food even MORE. I'm sure the issue here is Markus is bored with the one type of food. Can you try mixing it up? The Classic varieties of Fancy Feast are grain-free and decent quality when you're on a budget, my cats LOVE the ones with cheddar.

My girls get bored with food quickly, so I always have a rotation. If I were you, I would try rotating different flavors and textures of wet food before touching dry food. Friskies and Fancy Feast have a pretty big selection of flavors and textures. Feeding wet food with grains, gluten, and fillers (commonly the "grilled" or "meaty bits" varieties of Friskies and Fancy Feast) is STILL better than dry food! And right now, we just want to get Markus' calories up! My Ellie refuses to eat wet food a lot of times, so sometimes I feed her the Meaty Bits of Friskies or the Grilled varieties of Fancy Feast because they really entice her to eat. It's all about finding what textures and flavors are their favorites. And like I said before, ANY wet food is better than dry... especially the crappy ingredients of Royal Canin.

Another option is to check out Big Lots, if you have one near you. Sometimes they have better brands of food for cheap. Mine had Nutro Natural Balance grain-free canned food for only .50 cents a can! I stocked up on a ton when I saw them. They also have coupons for an additional 20% off some days.

Markus and your other kitties are SO cute! I love the one of them all on the couch. Thanks for sharing pictures!

 

A cat with a history of crystals should never be anywhere near dry food. That said, if you're going to go with dry anyway, then S/O is the way to go. Of the prescription diets it's the best one. The chicken meal is actually the only ingredient that you should like. There is nothing wrong with chicken meal. What comes after it...well that's all junk. The food is nutritionally balanced, it meets AAFCO requirements.

While S/O does have a higher salt content to encourage drinking, it also contains ingredients that help dissolve crystals and keep the urine pH more acidic. It's also lower in magnesium and phosphorus. All important things for a cat with a history of crystals. Standard off the shelf dry foods do not do this.

I agree with Mandy & Ellie that giving him dry may encourage his snubbing of the wet and make the situation worse. On the other hand he needs to be an appropriate weight. This article may give you some ideas to try to encourage eating more canned food:

http://catinfo.org/docs/TipsForTransitioning1-14-11.pdf

The one thing the article doesn't mention is texture...some cats will eat anything, but others may have a distinct preference for pate or for shreds/chunks...so pay attention to whether he eats more when given one or the other.

 

As I stated in the first line of my post, the cats ARE on all wet food. I'm not sure why I got some of the replies I did.

I did look more into this food last night on my own, and found that (according to catinfo.com) the crystals aren't the actual problem, they're the symptom. I was wondering why we would treat the crystals anyway, honestly, since he hasn't had them since being on proper food. Furthermore, what I found about the acidifying properties of this food is that they do not treat the actual condition, just the symptom - the acid basically makes the crystals disappear, it doesn't actually treat the underlying cause of lack of water. Even better, they only treat one of two types of crystals, and he hasn't even been diagnosed with that type of crystals. So I'm very much not impressed - either with the fact that we're treating a condition he may or may not still have OR that the food doesn't actually address the issue.

I picked up some Authority and tried to get him to eat it, no change. I've tried rotations, and he actually seems to turn up his nose at that more, although I'll try for it again. Rotations are hard with his brother, who pukes like clockwork with every minor food change, but if I'm feeding two separate foods anyway then it's no different.

Markus straight up refused to eat this morning, so I'm going to try to feed him later today. I feel like we've taken ten steps back with offering some dry food yesterday. Would you then recommend sticking with the 25/75 split? My instinct is to go back to straight up wet food and throw the dry food in the trash.

 

As I stated in the first line of my post, the cats ARE on all wet food. I'm not sure why I got some of the replies I did.

I read your post thoroughly - I know you said they're all on wet currently. However, you said you're feeding the big pate style cans of Friskies... which is why I recommended trying different textures, flavors, anything to get him to eat.

My cats Ellie and Tootsie are so picky that they refuse to eat the same flavor or texture twice in a day. I feed them a big variety of their favorites - my girls prefer shredded, minced, anything that's more chunky. Rarely will they eat pate.

You say you tried Authority... what flavor? What texture? Right now, I'd recommend buying a variety of cans... if you're currently feeding Friskies, go buy the 5.5oz cans and choose from their big variety of flavors/textures to see if he likes any more than others. For example - get one that's beef flavored and shredded. Find another that's meaty bits and Chicken. If that makes any sense. I can't buy cases online because my cats love such a huge variety, and will be picky and refuse to eat if they don't get a variety.

 

Btw - I forgot to mention, but he is on a rotation of about 5 different flavors. The base of the foods are the turkey and poultry platter varieties, but he also gets every other flavor that isn't fish-based on a regular basis.

 

Now I'm confused. You say they ARE all on but in the last line of that post you say are on 25/75..... that's not all wet.

I'd suggest driving by the animal shelter and handing them the opened bag of dry and never buying it again.

Wet only. Always for this problem, wet only. If it needs to be prescription, it should be the wet variety.

 

I think the responses you got pretty much lined up to your post. Yes, you said that you're feeding wet food, but went on to say that Markus isn't eating enough, lost too much weight and the vet is suggesting S/O be added to his diet so he gets enough calories.

Yes, crystals are a symptom of dehydration...treating the symptom by having ingredients that dissolve the crystals will ensure that he doesn't block. S/O does promote drinking by adding salt, but not enough to prevent crystals from forming, so they put stuff in it to dissolve them. You'd have to ask the vet why she recommended S/O if he doesn't have struvite crystals (which are most common, oxalate are pretty rare).

As far as whether he may or may not have the condition anymore...any cat that exhibits issues with crystals while on dry food is always prone to them going forward. Even feeding a quarter or half of their food as dry is playing with fire. Having issues with crystals is a very serious condition and a cat that has his urethra blocked by crystals can die in 24 hours and you may not even pick up on his symptoms, especially in a multi-cat household.

 

Thank you, I appreciate the help. I had found an out-dated paper, apparently, as I did some more looking into struvite vs oxalate stones and found this: "in 2006, 50 percent of stones were struvite and 39 percent were calcium oxalate. This may have been due to the increased use of diets designed to prevent calcium oxalate crystal formation, which because of increased magnesium in the diet and decreased acidity of the urine help promote struvite crystal formation." This was cited on Wikipedia, but it's sourced directly to a research paper.

I'm looking into alternative sources of gaining weight. Like I said, the variety didn't seem to help much, so I'm looking at raw feeding. That's an awfully tough sell to my husband (funny, because it's his cat). I guess I just have to keep working on it. Thanks again for your help.

 

The OP did post that the cat is on an all wet diet since last summer. The vet is the one who suggested to have the cat on dry/wet mix. Feeding a food with added salt to entice thirst is not something I would want to have. I would be afraid of inadvertently causing an imbalance of electrolytes.

Adding extra water is a good way to go instead of feeding junk food like s/o. Would you be open to trying raw? Even if you could have 1 raw meal a day may help increase water consumption in combination with a canned diet.

Animal feed is usually held at a lower standard so I wouldn't find that an animal feed according to AAFCO standards are all that much better than the next.

 

I'm completely open on it, trying to sell husband on it. Even wet food was a very, very hard sell and as a teacher working 12-14 hours a day, I'm not home for feeding times so he has to do it. I'll keep working on him, I might just order a 5 lb complete meal kit and see how Markus likes it. Thanks for noticing about the feeding!

 

Just out of curiosity, why is your husband against raw or even canned?
I don't eat meat myself but I recognize that cats are obligate carnivores, so I don't have any issues and my cat is thriving on raw. I don't particularly enjoy handling raw meat but the commercial raw is pretty much like opening a can just without the smell of cat food. Maybe some reading for hubby on the benefits and needs of cats?

 

He's basically against the expense and inconvenience of it. It was a tough sell to get him to stop free-feeding, then to transition to wet (about 15 extra dollars a month). Raw for one cat would be an extra 30-35 dollars a month each, for a family with one person in school and me on a teacher's salary. I'm working on finding a site that doesn't have exorbitant delivery fees so we can try it - does anyone know of one that does complete meals? I was working off rawpawspet.com, but the delivery fee is 25 dollars. I looked at Texas Tripe, but I can't make the drop time. Any other ideas? Maybe if I can just order a bit, like 5 lbs, then I can sell husband on it. He understands the theory, I just don't think he really connects it with reality.

 

Remember when running the numbers above that each one is times 4 for 4 cats, so raw feeding would be an extra 120-140 a month - plus delivery fee. Right now we get our wet food delivered free from Chewy.com.

 

I find it's much cheaper to buy meats and meaty bones from a butcher or abattoir instead of the commercial prepared raw found in pet stores. The prepared raw is very convenient but much more expensive than if you were to shop around and buy meats separately. Plus, chewing on bones keeps teeth nice and clean.

 

I agree. I used to make the raw food at home and it was way cheaper than canned after the initial investment. This is the recipe I used to follow:
http://www.catinfo.org/?link=makingcatfood

I only switched to commercial raw because my cat has IBD and needs to be on rare proteins.

Another way to look at it for hubby is the money you save down the road. Yes, it costs a bit more per month now, but I strongly believe that good and species appropriate nutrition is important to help prevent diseases as they get older. In any case, it's the only thing you can influence. Genetics and predisposition you can't change, but with the food you can make a difference.

 

Oh and I buy the commercial raw at an independent pet store, so no delivery fees. They can order what you need.

 

Ordering raw online is very expensive due to the packaging needed to keep it frozen and the overnight shipping fees. If you just want to try a commercial raw, then go to a local independent pet supply store in your area. Go to the Primal, Nature's Variety, Stella & Chewy's or RadCat websites and look for their store locator to find something near you. Honest Kitchen would be another possibility for you.

 

Okay, gonna try to reply to all of it over a page split.

Prepping at home is going to be my last resort for a host of reasons, which I'm sure you've all heard before. However, if I get down to that, I'll definitely try it.

Good news, though! All the varieties except RadCat that doodlebug mentioned are available locally. Which one would be most highly recommended for a starter?

Mandy/Ellie - I'm continuing to pick up cans - I got him to eat some chicken chunky Authority today. Tomorrow, the plan is to pick up some Halo and try that. The best luck I've had with him is feeding him four or five times a day - he seems to be eating about 6 ounces in that case. Every once in a while I'll shove like three kibbles of the dry food in there and he'll eat for that. It's not my favorite, but at least he's getting his resting metabolic rate in food.

Any and all ideas are welcome! I appreciate it.

 

Good news, though! All the varieties except RadCat that doodlebug mentioned are available locally. Which one would be most highly recommended for a starter?

Primal Raw has a starter pack for cats, which contains three 'nuggets' each of five or six different meats. My local independent pet store had the starter pack even though they don't normally carry the cat Primal (it was in the dog Primal freezer). I think the starter pack cost me about $5. Otherwise the bags come in 3lb sizes so it can be a costly mistake during the trial/error process.

Nature's Variety comes in much smaller bags so it's an easy one to try out. I've found the chicken and occasionally the duck and rabbit varieties at Petco, surprisingly.

And I feel your pain... My spouse was completely grossed out by the whole idea of raw. It took several weeks of discussion before he was on board- I had already started feeding it, because I'm pretty stubborn, but he wouldn't listen to the feeding instructions so they were always waiting for me to get home so they could eat. After several months, he's got no problems feeding them. I use the Primal Raw mostly, which comes in little brick-like nuggets; I put the appropriate amount of nuggets in each cat's bowl, put the bowls in the fridge to thaw overnight/during the day, and then he just takes them out and serves them!

Definitely order the food locally, though. No reason to pay high shipping costs. I set up a standing order with my local pet store, and just have to go in once a month to pick up my 18 pounds of Primal raw... can't imagine how much that would cost to ship!

 

Go with Nature's Variety...they have fish free formulas. Also...sign up on their website...they do a lot of coupons.

You might want to call before going to the store, they don't always carry cat (I don't) but they can order it for you so don't be shy about asking.

 

Hi, I've been somewhat leery of Royal Canin myself lately... before I knew better, I figured it was best that Jasper was on a breed-specific food.... I've since realized that there's not much merit in that thinking, now feeding him exclusively grain-free wet, but Jasper LOVES with a capital L his Persian kitten kibbles from Royal Canin as a treat, and I've had a lot of success using it to accustom him to being combed daily... I'm not crazy about the ingredients though, and I'm definitely looking for suggestions for a better kibble to use as a treat during his daily brushing ...

 

Cat foods labeled as 'complete and balanced' must meet standards established by the Association of American Feed Control Officials (AAFCO). I was surprised to see that my local supermarket's house label wet cat food had passed the standard (info was on the label). It's half to a third the price of the brand names. So check out those labels. Oh, and my kitties love it.

 

Being labeled AAFCO approved doesn't make all foods equal.

Meow Mix is AAFCO approved and so is Wild Calling.....there is a WORLD of difference in quality and with the health issues the OPs cat has, those differences are important.

 

MowMow,
Amen! So very true! After becoming an ingredient reader of all pet foods (dog&cat) there is a world of difference in what is in them! After I learned some things about cat food here, I even changed my dogs to a much better food!

Look at what the FDA approves for us!
Is it all healthy? Not by a long shot!